How are you earning a living while traveling?

Question

I’ve been traveling for over a year, and I’ve been working on 3 month contracts in locations abroad to sustain travel. I wanted to see what the community was like as far as digital nomads go. Are you trading your skills for $$$? and if so, how are you doing it?
(I’ve also wanted to try this, but haven’t been to successful.)

jonmyers · Accepted Answer

You need a skill or an asset.
If you have a skill, you must have a presence and way of broadcasting the availability of your skill (known speaker from conferences, twitter, blog, personal network, etc…) to a broader audience.
I have a niche design studio focused on UX/ UI. This is how I have earned over the years. All relationship/ wom driven.
For selling your skill - you have to do everything possible to remove the perceived flake factor from being a mobile entrepreneur.
That means having a process from start to finish of managing your customers. That means not flaking out and drawing attention to the time differences. That means when you talk to your customer you do the math of the time differences and only speak in terms of their time zone - not yours.
Don’t be like these fools constantly broadcasting the luxuries of the road with pictures of your coconut and laptop as you work at the beach.
In many cases, if your customer base is in the west, they’re probably freezing their asses off in a blizzard (as is the case in NYC at the moment) - and this whole charade simply breeds jealousy and contempt. Why open yourself up to it?
Further, that drives down the perceived value of your services because you are perceived as just, vacationing.
If you are in asset mode - that takes a lot longer, and asset in this case as hodar describes could be a real scalable startup, passive income business, etc…

jonmyers · Answer

Yes it is very possible.
And, I am just a small fry. Total, poorly marketed small potatoes I am with an online presence that needs serious attention.
I have done a lot of higher level consulting over the years, and it is possible to get to numbers at that level.
Although not exclusively, I have done a lot of consulting work with large government contractors, governments, finance, biotechnology and directly with VC firms.
All referral based. I have never approached any of these firms.
I simply have a network and people in that network who think of me in a certain way.
I intentionally love and go after - expensive big problems.
Unsexy verticals.
As I mentioned elsewhere here, you have to filter your craft/ offering, ex., through the filter of business strategy, and tie that to business defensibility and results.
So, while I come in to a business in the capacity of a “designer” - what they really are after is - how I dig into their business, the thinking around that and the strategy of how I shape the offering.
Thus, it comes down to one thing - positioning.
That’s how I position myself.
They can work with a big, expensive dying agency and their B and C players who don’t get it (or care as much) or they can get a specialist.
I come in as the specialist.
When a prospect approaches me, I have a process from start to finish - so they know exactly what they are getting, how we work together and the value of it.

In terms of how to get those connections and build that network, I wish I had a more non-evasive answer.
I honestly don’t have a great answer to that question.
It just happens for me.
But, if I had to boil it down it comes down to one thing:
Relationships
I make relationships fast.
I don’t give a shit about social conventions.
I approach every single person around me with the same level of respect.
From the person sweeping the street to the suits in the ivory towers.
Respect.
Acknowledgement of their presence.
And, on the flip side with those in power.
There is a tendency towards pedestal thinking - putting powerful, important people on a pedestal above you.
I don’t give a flying fuck about that shit either. lol
Just be real, be direct and do not compromise your position.
Approach powerful people with respect and assume you are on the same level.
Don’t be a kiss ass. Don’t be a worshiper.
And be willing to walk away.

So with that - - - - you wanna know how I cracked the code to business in Vietnam?
I told a guy in a stairwell he had nice shoes one day.
That’s it.
I notice people around me.
I acknowledge them and I assign ZERO intentionality to the outcome of acknowledgment.
When I first arrived in Vietnam 3 years ago, I noticed a guy in my apartment building I would always pass who was well dressed, I liked his fashion sense and just got a good vibe from him.
So, one day I said to him “I’m not gay, but you are one handsomely dressed guy. Love your shoes. Seems like we should know each other. What’s your story”.
And with that, the guy became a loose acquaintance of mine.
Turns out he is a successful, well-connected entrepreneur in Vietnam.
Then…
He is always in situations where he has met business owners, decision makers in companies who need design services.
Guess who he recommends.
Me.
To this day, he has referred me 100s of thousands in business.
I never ever even asked for referrals. I never do.
I have hounded him to try and pay some kind of referral fee for the gesture and he flat out refuses. Guy barely will let me buy him a drink for the gesture.
I’ve done his referrals right and that has snowballed into more referrals and relationships with those whom he has referred, which go off onto other vectors.

So, if there is one lesson, I’d say - it is to plant yourself always in the action, in some way. Don’t be out in the sticks. Always be in the center of whatever city you are in. Set yourself up for serendipity. Engineer that serendipity by getting out of the house.
You have to be present and be open to fearlessly opening conversations with those around you.
WATCH where you plant yourself as well.
If you plant yourself around a bunch of backpackers drinking dollar beers, it’s likely that will be the depth of your network.
Backpackers sipping on dollar beers.
Oscillate in and out of many scenes. Not just one.
And don’t be a weirdo just opening conversations to get something. Never have an agenda other than curiosity about the other person.
Let it happen naturally.
You can never have too many friends.
–
I’m out of time now, but reply to this and remind me - and I’ll tell you how I raised venture capital and became buddies with a mayor all by giving away 1000’s of dollars of free tacos and beer to strangers.
There are many unconventional ways to put yourself out there, and more importantly help others connect.
Cheers, hope that helps.
-j

andrusha · Answer

Freelance sucks, remote is the future.
Here is why:

Freelancer is not a part of the team, you’re brought up to solve a particular problem, you done and you’re out, while the team is on to bigger and better things;
Freelancer has to hustle hard, 10x harder than everybody else. You have to find right gigs at the right time, network like crazy, be visible, be bold;
Freelancing is running one-man company all by yourself, the effort to maintain it is time lost doing what matters most.

On contrary:

Remote worker can plan ahead, meet saving goals, travel for longer periods;
Remote worker grows with the company, he’s worth investing in, he learn new things and exchange knowledge;
Working remotely is more productive, you put in as many hours as its comfortable during your peak performance.

Many online agencies will empathize short-term freelancing, instead of long-term remote contracts, which lead you nowhere. So, know what you want, be picky, don’t let yourself get into never ending carousel of quick engagements.
As for me, I went from getting myself through university with freelancing, to full-time remote work on startups and now I’m with toptal, which got me into nomadic lifestyle in the first place.

jonmyers · Answer

Hey @DoRiS83
I’m difficult. I’m not a hostel person at all. I did the hostel thing a few times when I was younger and living and India, but I prefer to have a personal space, which I can control, have peace and quiet in and so on.
Thus, when I first arrived in Saigon, I rented a furnished apartment, initially for a 3 month term, which is very common here. I found it easily. A nice Ikea shabby chic place, which was about $650/ $700 month.
I didn’t know a soul in Saigon before I arrived. Back then, there was no DC presence here, and not much of a “nomad” scene per se. That doofus NomadicMatt’s article on Saigon kept me away. In retrospect the article was childish, immature and entitled. Should have known better.
My plan was just to do a visa run from Thailand to Saigon and bounce back to Thailand to figure out a new home base.
I’m not a huge Thailand fan. I like it. I don’t love it. Sort of the way I like San Francisco, but find it an annoying mismanaged city, but I love NYC. Personal preferences.
So, with not knowing a soul in Saigon, I began to dig around on Twitter - and just tweet at people who were based in Saigon before I arrived, who were interested in Startups and Design.
I got lucky from that - contacted some expat entrepreneurs on Twitter, I hit a happy hour with them the day I arrived - and next thing I know - I just got sucked in and connected in a matter of another day or so.
I knew right then I I loved Saigon, went back to Thailand, packed my shit up and headed back to Saigon as fast as I could.
Those initial contacts helped me find my first apartment and the rest is history.

In general, if you’re proactive and enthusiastic when you visit places, I can’t see it being hard getting connected or finding housing.
I hear this “problem” being throw around all the time.
I find it to be BS.

I got the bright idea I wanted to live in Krabi, Thailand for 6 months, where I was at before Saigon - and again, I didn’t really know a soul there. I had no clue how to even begin searching for housing.
So, I walked a strip in front of the beach in an adjacent beach town called Nopparatara my first day there. I saw a nice Italian restaurant there and I saw what looked like a nice young couple who appeared to have experience in the town based on the way I observed them interact with their local Thai staff.
I went in to the restaurant. Ordered food, and then proceeded to order the most expensive bottle of wine they had on the menu.
I then asked them for 3 glasses total and invited them to sit down and join me for the wine, which they did.
That bottle turned into another and another.
The guy asked me what I was doing in the town and I told him I was looking for accommodations.
He told me to come back the next day at 2PM and he took me around until I found a house for rent.
The house, a beautiful small house - $320/ month.
I got to be good friends with them, and other members of the Italian community based in Aonang/ Krabi.

The main thing is this - - - -
Keep your antenna up. Keep your radar on at all times. Observe others.
Be a fearless opener.
And be prepared to be kind and generous in the beginning. Have an abundance mindset, not the penny pinching, bullshit backpacker mentality that perpetuates the cycle of scarcity.
Rarely has that bitten me in the ass and rarely have I been taken advantage of going through the world that way.
-j

johnnyfd · Answer

The first 4 years I made money either going back home and working for the summer and saving up.
Then I started teaching Scuba Diving. Then I wrote a book. Here’s a mega post where I documented what I did for the first 5 years and how I made money: How I afford my life of travel.
Now I write monthly income reports on my blog.

surfcoderepeat · Answer

HI @mattlock,  I’ve been doing my own thing for 5 years now and the income sources changed over time (Started with adsense niche sites), in the last 3 years i created a really consistent income with a few ecommerce sites and some service type sites (Example video creation), I have a remote team that takes care of most of the work while I manage where all is going and work on side projects like trimpics.com .
Currently living in Santa Teresa, Costa Rica

angsmith · Answer

I lead product & UI/UX design at a tech company in San Francisco (remote obviously). Like @nambrot mentioned, it’s great being paid a US salary traveling through countries with a much lower cost of living. I do work a lot though, so I generally stay in each city for 2-3 months.

nambrot · Answer

I am a part-time employee for a US company. This is the time to take advantage of the immense salary situation in the US while spending it elsewhere. If you are a dev, I believe its the way to do it

jonmyers · Answer

I have a fairly established personal network and don’t look for customers. I haven’t in a long time.
Thus, everything is word of mouth. Sometimes Twitter, oddly enough. But, mostly just word of mouth. People I know and have spent time with or who I have helped for free in the past.
Also, don’t overlook opportunities in the places you adopt to live.
I’m based in HCMC, Vietnam.
I have a homebase here, a home office, which I can bring customers to, etc…
Somehow, out of the ether, through a combination of some press mentions on Virgin, and my personal network I have built over the last three years here, I have secured LOTS of consulting/ design work in Southeast Asia. Mainly, linked to being in Vietnam.
In fact, the volume of business here for me, has now eclipsed my work in the west. I command the same fees here and more, and they have the budgets to afford me.
I’ll easily do mid-six figures here this year as a lone wolf. If I really hustle, I think I can double that number. My pipeline keeps growing in this region, and if I actually hung out a shingle like a legitimate design studio, yes, I could double numbers easily.
The main reason that is coming in though is - for one, I am not at a beach with a vacation vibe or out in a province. Real work is here. Real investment is here and most of the work I am doing is related to banking, insurance, venture capital and telecom.
Secondly, I am not transient here.
I have a home I rent with a proper office inside. I have a base.
I can have my customers here come over, whiteboard and work with me in my office/ design studio.
On the outsourcing side.
No, I can’t do that - what I’m doing you can’t outsource. It would be a nightmare for me to try and manage all logistics.
What I am doing with some customers here now…
I have them hire, pay and manage dedicated staff to support me and the project.
I train the staff, do the knowledge transfer, and they can pay me a retainer to check in, watch and further train the resources who will take over for me.
I’m not worried they can fully take over. They are paying for me, and when the next big projects come up - they bring me in.
Beats me trying to hire, train and manage staff.
Mostly though, it keeps my bandwidth open for more projects and keeps me focused on the fun stuff, which for me is  - – - design.

nambrot · Answer

holy cow, mid-six figures easily? When you say you can double easily, does that mean you nearly reach seven-figures? Sorry if I’m so narrowly focused on this, but I have never seen this kind of income with contracting outside startup exits or big co money. I’d love to know whether you have any tips for someone getting started on that

mattlock · Answer

jonmyers:

In many cases, if your customer base is in the west, they’re probably freezing their asses off in a blizzard (as is the case in NYC at the moment) - and this whole charade simply breeds jealousy and contempt. Why open yourself up to it?

Thanks a million for the honest feedback – I appreciate it. How were you able to secure your first clients? Are you doing any type of outsourcing at the moment or is it all in house?

wanderingdev · Answer

I graduated from a dev bootcamp style program in October and got a job as a web developer for a company that lets me work remote.

johnnyfd · Answer

Working remote is a great way to travel and live somewhere else while earning a U.S. Wage.
However, I honestly think freelancing is better…if you have time to work on your own business on the side.
EVERYONE gets sick of their boss, or working for a company no matter how great it is eventually.
I recommend:

Either saving and bootstrapping while working on your side business

or

Freelancing part time while working on your side business.

I had 1 stream of income when I started, now I have six.  I write them in my income reports every month and recomend anyone to have their own streams of income of their own.

jasoncookdesign · Answer

I broke off from the UX agency/consultancy life and co-founded my own shop with a couple partners, got a few years under our belt to establish a client base and stability, then got on a plane. When I need to, I travel to the US for face time, but otherwise I do the same thing I was doing in my office, just from wherever I am. I make myself available during US business hours in general, particularly when it comes to client meetings, but I’ve always worked strange hours so that’s just pay for the course with me and my partners know it.

iamgabrielma · Answer

I think you’re messing the terms in your head, you’re comparing apples with cars, I guess your point was remote contract work vs remote freelance work, because remote can be freelance and freelance can be on-site too. Either way, those options are not mutually excluding, you can have your long-term contract with a business and at the same time land small gigs here and there.

mrdanielschwarz · Answer

Are you a skilled writer?
I write about design for blogs such as Designmodo, Smashing Magazine and Sitepoint. Pros:

Blogs will always be there
No limit to how many articles you can write
Write when you want
Straightforward way of being paid

mattlock · Answer

angelasmith:

great being paid a US salary traveling thro

This is so smart. I wish I would have done that before I left. But looks like it’s a massive growing trend with a lot of startups.

dorischow83 · Answer

Hi @jonmyers,
Thank you so much for your explanation. I can’t wait to hit the roads and try some of your advice myself.
With Gratitude,
Doris

ani_goes_tweet · Answer

I am rather surprised by your dismissal of freelance work. What I do, as a freelancer, bears little resemblance to your description, and I would never trade it for being employed by someone. I relish my freedom, I work as much or as little as i want to - I only accept the jobs that  I want, and I take the time for myself that I want.

dorischow83 · Answer

Thank you @jonmyers for sharing. I learnt a lot from your posts. When you first went to Vietnam, what sort of apartment building/accommodation are you looking for? It sure sounds like apartments may be a better place to meet people than guest-houses. Did you rent a room in an apartment building? How did you select the neighbourhood? Thanks for your help!

nambrot · Answer

Holw cow, thanks again for such an insightful answer. I’m currently with my family who is all in Hanoi, so I can certainly testify to the sticking-to-people-you-trust mentality, I guess I never have actually seen it play out that well for “knowledge” workers like us (more for friends of the party etc.)

busdriver · Answer

I think what many people are looking for is something where you can work a few months and than go off-grid / travel, … with little working needed.
I invested many years and now I am at that point. I would work say 2-3 month to set up something (and invest 20-30000 USD in cash) that than would work for me and make money for a few years. That concept works for me now for maybe 10 years, it’s just getting better for me, the more of those “profit centers” I am setting up. (But one already allows an OK standard of living)
I know, it sounds like a dream that can’t be true, right?
Hmm, how can I describe it without it sounding fishy but also not revealing too much  ?
Me and 2 partners developed that business concept. It does require that that “investor” has “a good passport”, like a European one. Of course there is a lot of work to do to keep the business working, but we outsourced that (that’s why I know nice places on Cebu island and around there  )
Anyway, long story short. There are ways …
PS: It is not really an internet business

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